PUZZLER: Slides & jacks are dead

[dedmiston]

I'm having trouble with two systems in our fifth-wheel.

We have two slides in the living area (connected) and a bedroom slide. We also have Lippert leveling jacks. The functioning bedroom slide is a cable slide, and the living area slides are rack & pinion. I don't know whether they're hydraulic or not.

First some background and then the symptoms...

_______________________
Background:

We dry camped last weekend and I thought our batteries were going bad. We have 700w of solar panels that always do a great job, but we camped at the beach where it was drizzly and overcast most of the weekend and the solar wasn't much use.

When we left at the end of that weekend, the jacks were hard to retract. The motor bogged down and the battery voltage dropped. I didn't pay attention to the actual voltage on the panel beyond seeing that it had dropped a lot. I ran the gen and that helped, but not as much as I expected. I don't know if the gen was actually assisting, or if it was just the stopping and waiting that made the difference.

When we got home and put the fiver away in storage, I ran the gen while I unhooked and deployed the jacks & leveled. It was still labored.

I assumed that my batteries suddenly lost their will to live, so I replaced them with four more similar GC2 6V on Thursday. The batteries were five years old and kind of swollen, so I figured this would be the fix.

_______________________
Actual Problem:

After installing the new batteries, I hooked up the shore power to our 50A connection at home overnight and left it connected.

Mid-day I opened the slides to pack a few things before this weekend's trip (now cancelled). The slides were really hard to deploy and retract. The bedroom slide worked fine though.

Later in the afternoon when it was time to leave, I tried to run the slides out again, but the switch was dead.

It makes a "thunk" sound in the front compartment where the batteries and gen live. That's it. Just "thunk", but no movement.

I called my mobile tech and he told me to look for a reset switch, but I never found one. (He came out later and couldn't find one either).

Before he came out, I tried the jacks too just for kicks, and the jacks were dead too. Just a "thunk" in the same spot.

I checked all the breakers and fuses and everything is good. Ditto for the battery voltage, and I'm still plugged into shore power. I also disconnected the shore power just for kicks to see if that made any difference.

It feels like there's some kind of switch that is tripping when the motor thinks it's hot. Before bed, I tried to retract the jacks again because I can't keep the fiver in front of my house another night. The jacks retracted in the cooler evening, but the motor quit just as they were finishing retracting.

My tech thinks the problem is with the hydraulic pump, and he thinks it's shared between the jacks and the slides. I don't necessarily agree. Yes, the "thunk" is common and shared, but I don't believe that the slides share the same hydraulic system (if they're hydraulic). I've watched the fluid levels carefully when I deploy/retract the jacks, and the level stays the same whether the slides are in or out.

As it stands now, I have no jacks and no slides. I'm leaving for storage in a minute and I'll probably have to use my drill to run the jacks down so I can unhitch.

So as it stands now, the slides and jacks will sort of work intermittently, but more often they're just dead. I'll be happy if replacing the pump works, but I'm not convinced. And with so many delays in getting parts nowadays, I hate to do a lot of trial and error if we don't have to.

Any thoughts?

[trailrider]

Hopefully we will get an update on what the solution to the problem was.

[ChuckSteed]

It would help if you knew your RV and what it does or doesn’t have for slide motion and leveling motion.. this way I could precisely tell you where to look and what to check..

If hydrauilc slide out the THUNK noisier you are hearing is the dual polarity solenoid mo7nted on the hyd pump motor.

That indicates you are getting power to solenoid but not enough to run the pump motor..

Here is a l8nk to tell you how to test the solenoid and pump motor.
These should be located inside an access door on one of the sides and you would,not be trying to gain access via underneath

https://lci-support-doc.s3.amazonaws.com/technical-information-sheets/slideouts/ccd_0001894.pdf

There is also,a manual,override for the slide and leveling system if this is hydraulic

Need specifics as to what your systems are or aren’t to accurately help you an6 further

[dedmiston]

Grit dog wrote:
Not familiar with the system(s) on your trailer, but if other 12V systems work properly and both the jacks and the slides are iffy, tells me they run off the same system or a same relay and that the issue is not downstream at the jacks or slides themselves.
Maybe I just stated the obvious but??
Unfortunately you may have to open stuff up to find the location of the “thump” noise and go from there.
Sorry this probably is of not much help…

Thanks man.

It's 10x more helpful than "your tech stinks".

[Grit_dog]

Not familiar with the system(s) on your trailer, but if other 12V systems work properly and both the jacks and the slides are iffy, tells me they run off the same system or a same relay and that the issue is not downstream at the jacks or slides themselves.
Maybe I just stated the obvious but??
Unfortunately you may have to open stuff up to find the location of the “thump” noise and go from there.
Sorry this probably is of not much help…

[trailrider]

A "tech" could diagnose the problem and fix it. A "parts replacer" thinks it's the hydraulic pump. Your relay/solenoid that clunks is probably on it's way out and isn't sending enough voltage/current to the hydraulic pump motor. The motor or pump could be going bad also. Or a bad ground as suggested above.

[dedmiston]

CA Traveler wrote:
My first thought is your tech is clueless, find someone experienced. Rack and pinion suggests electric. Hydraulic would have 2 hoses per cylinder - 2 for a jack and 2 for each hydraulic ram. He should be able to easily determine what you have.

The thunks are likely a solenoid or heavy relay. Your switches cannot handle the very power draw so they activate the solenoid which has a second heavy wire from the battery.

I would start with a digital voltmeter connected to a clean frame ground (not a wire) to the battery + cable. What is the voltage when the clunk occurs? Continue downstream and you should have close to 0V on the negative wire and 11-12V on the positive wire to the motor.

I'm also wondering if the batteries are wired correctly, one or more reversed. And don't assume new batteries haven't failed, it happens.

Don’t blame the tech just because I disagree with him.

The underbelly is sealed and there’s no way to see the slide motor without cutting into it.

The only reason I’m skeptical is because the reservoir only supplies the jacks and not the slides as far as I can tell.

[CA_Traveler]

My first thought is your tech is clueless, find someone experienced. Rack and pinion suggests electric. Hydraulic would have 2 hoses per cylinder - 2 for a jack and 2 for each hydraulic ram. He should be able to easily determine what you have.

The thunks are likely a solenoid or heavy relay. Your switches cannot handle the very power draw so they activate the solenoid which has a second heavy wire from the battery.

I would start with a digital voltmeter connected to a clean frame ground (not a wire) to the battery + cable. What is the voltage when the clunk occurs? Continue downstream and you should have close to 0V on the negative wire and 11-12V on the positive wire to the motor.

I'm also wondering if the batteries are wired correctly, one or more reversed. And don't assume new batteries haven't failed, it happens.

[dedmiston]

Second Chance wrote:
On our Solitude fifth wheel, the leveling system and slides share the hydraulic pump and motor and use switching solenoids (perhaps the "thunk" you're hearing) to control everything.

Rob

Same fluids or is there another reservoir?

[Seattle_Steve]

Converter problems was my first thought as well. Normally your batteries are charging fine from solar, so you don't notice that the converter isn't working until no solar.

[Second_Chance]

On our Solitude fifth wheel, the leveling system and slides share the hydraulic pump and motor and use switching solenoids (perhaps the "thunk" you're hearing) to control everything.

Rob

[dedmiston]

JCK wrote:
If your slides are rack and pinion there electric and your jacks may be electric also. Sure sounds to me like you have a electrical problem . First you need to do some checking with a volt meter what’s the resting voltage after a night of charging let them rest a couple hours and check compare to battery charts that are available on the internet. While your at it check the charging voltage also and compare to what your converter is rated at. Look at your converted and after making sure shore power is disconnected then tighten all the screws on the distribution board both sides. Something going on your batteries are not charging or bad converter. Could also be a bad frame ground or battery ground. Sluggish slides or jacks are almost always a low voltage issue.

Everything else is running fine off 12v and the jacks are definitely hydraulic.

It’s a sunny day and the solar is working. Batteries are at 13.8.

[JCK]

If your slides are rack and pinion there electric and your jacks may be electric also. Sure sounds to me like you have a electrical problem . First you need to do some checking with a volt meter what’s the resting voltage after a night of charging let them rest a couple hours and check compare to battery charts that are available on the internet. While your at it check the charging voltage also and compare to what your converter is rated at. Look at your converted and after making sure shore power is disconnected then tighten all the screws on the distribution board both sides. Something going on your batteries are not charging or bad converter. Could also be a bad frame ground or battery ground. Sluggish slides or jacks are almost always a low voltage issue.