Andersen Ultimate Hitch and half ton truck- Not so good

[johndeerefarmer]

I bought a '17 F150 in March. I tried to tow my GD Reflection 29rs and had all kinds of handling issues. I added Bilstein 4600's on the rear, and air bags. I then took off the air bags and installed Super Springs. I finally gave up and ordered a lighter and shorter Reflection 220rk. I got it last week and the problems persisted.
I finally borrowed a B&W Companion and all of my troubles went away. The Andersen unloads the front axle so much on a half ton that the truck just wandering all over the road and the steering was very light. With the Companion the steering feels tight like when not towing, this is because the pin is 1" in front of the rear axle and not behind it. With a heavy diesel engine and a heavy truck the front axle unloading may not be an issue but with a half ton with a light weight aluminum engine it was a major problem! I called Andersen and they knew nothing about it as they had no experience with it in a new F150. An engineer was supposed to call be back but that was 3 days ago. I am disappointed in my $800 hitch and the company.

[cummins2014]

johndeerefarmer wrote:

cummins2014 wrote:


Yes ,the facts are in a product, the "TRUCK". No hitch is going to fix an overweight problem, especially if it was mounted in the wrong position to start.

He would have got the same handling problems with that B&W if it was mounted rear of center of axle.

First, the truck was not overloaded. 1200 lbs pin weight doesn't overload my truck. I have had over 2000 lbs pin weight with my gooseneck trailer and NO HANDLING ISSUES.
Second, the hitch was not mounted in the wrong position. The AUH mounts to the ball of the B&W. The arrow on the AUH MUST face the rear. This places the pin way behind the axle. This is the design of the hitch. It works great for those with heavy trucks but not for my situation.

I am therefore warning other aluminum bodied F150 owners to avoid this hitch.

Avoid this hitch, for what reason, it was mounted rear of the axle. That was the reason for your problems, yes I agree avoid this hitch if you can't mount it in the proper position. If the gooseneck ball was forward ,the hitch would be forward , no issue. You insist you followed direction from B&W ,thats WHY the B&W sits where its supposed to, and not the Andersen.

Better yet, research the rail mount Andersen. First off the rails are mounted to the frame , no worries about having to shim the bed with the gooseneck ball mounted hitches ,regardless of whether it was Andersen or B&W. Second there are a few different mounting options. First the hitch can be mounted in either direction. Second as you should know the adapter can be mounted in either direction

IMO ,yes the h

[MFL]

johndeerefarmer Most don't know that the aluminum bed on the SD is thicker than that of the F150.[/quote wrote:


[quote=johndeerefarmer Most don't know that the aluminum bed on the SD is thicker than that of the F150

I was wondering about that...good info JDF. I don't think I'd use the plywood base with the B&W 3500, even with your 150, as the plastic supports are meant to sit in the bottom grooves. If you did use the plywood, I'd remove the plastic runners first.

A call to B&W gets immediate answers to questions. They do a lot of installations at B&W, so they should have first hand knowledge with aluminum bed Fords.

Jerry

[Dayle1]

johndeerefarmer wrote:


When I called Andersen I specifically asked them if I could reverse the hitch and they said no. I figured if I reversed the hitch and turned the coupler to the "normal" position the pin would be about right. Since they said no there must be a reason.

A quick online search reveals the Andersen installation instructions which state what I had previously said.

"For most 5th wheel installations, place the greaseless
opening towards the front of the kingpin.

IMPORTANT
Pay close attention to the length of the pin box. If there’s a possibility that it might hit the tailgate or side boards of your tow vehicle, then place the greaseless opening of
the coupler block behind the kingpin."

True it doesn't say this is an option if stability issues are encountered, but this simple change would have put the king pin back over the rear axle as it should be. So Andersen needs to do a better job of explaining this to it's customers, apparently both in documentation and over the phone.

[johndeerefarmer]

WTP-GC wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:


No here's the facts.

It's obvious you didn't read the OP tests to resolve his problem.
The OP stated clearly why his truck/camper combination handling was resolved.
Todays .5 ton trucks have heavier stronger frames, axles, brakes, and optional HD suspension thats light years better than older trucks.
Todays HD trucks are tuned hotter and pushing more power than ever and run hotter.
An Andersen engineer was called for tech support and didn't bother to call him back.


Bottom line the OP had a handling problem and tried several tests and resolved his problem. I commend people who report an issue with a product and even better include the fix.

Since internet forums aren't very useful in changing someone's opinions, we're going to have to agree to disagree.

But an actual FACT is that my 2014 6.7L RAM operates at roughly the same temperatures as my 1996 F350 7.3L PSD. The RAM actually runs a bit cooler on the coolant than the F350.

Regardless, I believe I join the chorus in saying "not enough truck". At comes from people with all kinds of hitch types in their signature lines.

I have a 21' PJ gooseneck trailer that weighs about 5500 lbs empty. I can put my 11k lb John Deere compact track loader on it. I can position the machine to make the pin weight whatever I want. I typically set it for 2000 lbs or so. I have no issues whatsoever pulling this load. It pulls straight and true and handles fine. (I can also apply the elect/hydraulic brakes and stop it on a dime) I can also place my 7000 lb tractor on the trailer and the results are the same. I understand that common sense isn't so common anymore but common sense says under these conditions the truck IS overloaded and it DOES NOT have issues; therefore the issue is the AUH not the truck.

[johndeerefarmer]

Since youtube stopped allowing free hosting I can't post a pix but the board goes from fender well to fender well. It's no deeper than the AUH. I sure didn't cause a problem and it may have prevented one. Most don't know that the aluminum bed on the SD is thicker than that of the F150.

[WTP-GC]

johndeerefarmer wrote:

I had a piece of plywood underneath the AUH to spread the load so the aluminum bed wouldn't be damaged.

Hmmmmm....
Did you disclose this to Andersen? I can't imagine how doing this didn't create an even worse (and more dangerous) problem.

[WTP-GC]

FishOnOne wrote:


No here's the facts.

It's obvious you didn't read the OP tests to resolve his problem.
The OP stated clearly why his truck/camper combination handling was resolved.
Todays .5 ton trucks have heavier stronger frames, axles, brakes, and optional HD suspension thats light years better than older trucks.
Todays HD trucks are tuned hotter and pushing more power than ever and run hotter.
An Andersen engineer was called for tech support and didn't bother to call him back.


Bottom line the OP had a handling problem and tried several tests and resolved his problem. I commend people who report an issue with a product and even better include the fix.

Since internet forums aren't very useful in changing someone's opinions, we're going to have to agree to disagree.

But an actual FACT is that my 2014 6.7L RAM operates at roughly the same temperatures as my 1996 F350 7.3L PSD. The RAM actually runs a bit cooler on the coolant than the F350.

Regardless, I believe I join the chorus in saying "not enough truck". At comes from people with all kinds of hitch types in their signature lines.

[johndeerefarmer]

time2roll wrote:
I agree if the truck was overloaded the heavier hitch would only make things worse.

Still I would have mounted the ball in a position to have the AUH ball in front of the axle 1" to 3" or you are asking for trouble. The fact that the AUH moves the effective weight point back is a poor design IMO. This would seem to affect all trucks even if some more than others.

Not sure how the aluminum bed material has an effect.

When I called Andersen I specifically asked them if I could reverse the hitch and they said no. I figured if I reversed the hitch and turned the coupler to the "normal" position the pin would be about right. Since they said no there must be a reason.

I had a piece of plywood underneath the AUH to spread the load so the aluminum bed wouldn't be damaged. My '13 F150 did weigh 800 lbs more than this oand that might have been enough weight to make the issue go away

[time2roll]

I agree if the truck was overloaded the heavier hitch would only make things worse.

Still I would have mounted the ball in a position to have the AUH ball in front of the axle 1" to 3" or you are asking for trouble. The fact that the AUH moves the effective weight point back is a poor design IMO. This would seem to affect all trucks even if some more than others.

Not sure how the aluminum bed material has an effect.

[johndeerefarmer]

cummins2014 wrote:


Yes ,the facts are in a product, the "TRUCK". No hitch is going to fix an overweight problem, especially if it was mounted in the wrong position to start.

He would have got the same handling problems with that B&W if it was mounted rear of center of axle.

First, the truck was not overloaded. 1200 lbs pin weight doesn't overload my truck. I have had over 2000 lbs pin weight with my gooseneck trailer and NO HANDLING ISSUES.
Second, the hitch was not mounted in the wrong position. The AUH mounts to the ball of the B&W. The arrow on the AUH MUST face the rear. This places the pin way behind the axle. This is the design of the hitch. It works great for those with heavy trucks but not for my situation.

I am therefore warning other aluminum bodied F150 owners to avoid this hitch.

[cummins2014]

FishOnOne wrote:

WTP-GC wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:
The OP test sounds very conclusive to me and your theory above is not backed by any tests with the OP configuration.

BTW... You do realize that todays 1 ton truck ratings have drastically increased from 1996 as well so it's just not half tons.

By the same notion, the OP is suggesting that the problem could be solved by using any traditional-style hitch. Regardless, the ACTUAL problem is "not enough truck". The problem the OP was experiencing is a symptom of a larger issue. He has temporarily sedated that issue, but a new symptom will eventually occur. It can sliced and diced and diagnosed or justified in any manner...but the fact remains: NOT ENOUGH TRUCK.

And yes, I know that trucks have all increased in tow/haul capacities. But there is a difference. My 1 ton RAM is a far more robust vehicle than previous generations of that truck as well as my 1996 F350. Everything from the transmission to the frame and the body, steering, etc. The heavy duty trucks are just simply bigger, heavier, and more capable. The 1/2 tons are trending in an opposite direction. Smaller footprint/wheelbase, lighter frames and bodies, smaller engines that are tuned higher and run hotter. It is not an apples for apples comparison.

No here's the facts.

It's obvious you didn't read the OP tests to resolve his problem.
The OP stated clearly why his truck/camper combination handling was resolved.
Todays .5 ton trucks have heavier stronger frames, axles, brakes, and optional HD suspension thats light years better than older trucks.
Todays HD trucks are tuned hotter and pushing more power than ever and run hotter.
An Andersen engineer was called for tech support and didn't bother to call him back.


Bottom line the OP had a handling problem and tried several tests and resolved his problem. I commend people who report an issue with a product and even better include the fix.

Yes ,the facts are in a product, the "TRUCK". No hitch is going to fix an overweight problem, especially if it was mounted in the wrong position to start.

He would have got the same handling problems with that B&W if it was mounted rear of center of axle.

[FishOnOne]

WTP-GC wrote:

FishOnOne wrote:
The OP test sounds very conclusive to me and your theory above is not backed by any tests with the OP configuration.

BTW... You do realize that todays 1 ton truck ratings have drastically increased from 1996 as well so it's just not half tons.

By the same notion, the OP is suggesting that the problem could be solved by using any traditional-style hitch. Regardless, the ACTUAL problem is "not enough truck". The problem the OP was experiencing is a symptom of a larger issue. He has temporarily sedated that issue, but a new symptom will eventually occur. It can sliced and diced and diagnosed or justified in any manner...but the fact remains: NOT ENOUGH TRUCK.

And yes, I know that trucks have all increased in tow/haul capacities. But there is a difference. My 1 ton RAM is a far more robust vehicle than previous generations of that truck as well as my 1996 F350. Everything from the transmission to the frame and the body, steering, etc. The heavy duty trucks are just simply bigger, heavier, and more capable. The 1/2 tons are trending in an opposite direction. Smaller footprint/wheelbase, lighter frames and bodies, smaller engines that are tuned higher and run hotter. It is not an apples for apples comparison.

No here's the facts.

It's obvious you didn't read the OP tests to resolve his problem.
The OP stated clearly why his truck/camper combination handling was resolved.
Todays .5 ton trucks have heavier stronger frames, axles, brakes, and optional HD suspension thats light years better than older trucks.
Todays HD trucks are tuned hotter and pushing more power than ever and run hotter.
An Andersen engineer was called for tech support and didn't bother to call him back.


Bottom line the OP had a handling problem and tried several tests and resolved his problem. I commend people who report an issue with a product and even better include the fix.

[Housted]

WTP-GC wrote:

Cummins12V98 wrote:

BTW...B&W will make ANY truck better! :B

Yeeeeaaaaaahhhhh OK ;);):B

Times 2 HeHe

[WTP-GC]

Cummins12V98 wrote:

BTW...B&W will make ANY truck better! :B

Yeeeeaaaaaahhhhh OK ;);):B