How cold can you go?

[campbikemom]

This is the time of year that we usually embark on our last camping trip. We were planning on making the trip last weekend our last of the year, but my 3 (soon to be 4) year old asked if we could go camping for his birthday after he saw another kid having a "camping birthday party." His birthday in mid-November.

I think it's a GREAT idea - save for the fact that we live in Central NY and we can have temperatures below freezing. Our current camper does not have an enclosed and heated underbelly. So, how cold can we reasonably expect to camp without disaster striking? Would high 20's/low 30's be OK or is anything close to freezing too risky?

Also, we could be crazy and camp in the trailer for a nice dry, heated placed to sleep and just not fill the water tanks. However, the camper hasn't been winterized so not sure that would even be OK.

[jseyfert3]

CavemanCharlie wrote:

campbikemom wrote:

profdant139 wrote:
A member just PMed me to ask about the wiper blades in that photo. I move them away from the glass when snow is in the forecast. That way, they don't freeze to the windshield.

You can imagine how I learned about that trick. Yep -- one time, I froze 'em, and then saw that other folks had pivoted them away from the glass. (Bear in mind that I am a Californian, not used to freezing weather. My guess is that small children in North Dakota learn about how to avoid "wiper freeze" before they start kindergarten.)

It's funny to me being in the snowiest city in North America to even think that people don't know that purpose. I need to remember at one point I also lived in the high desert where when it snows it melts within 12 hours.

I've lived in SW MN all my life. It is quite cold and snowy here. I've never seen anyone do this. I'm not sure why you would ? What does it hurt if they freeze to the windshield? You have to chip the ice and snow off of the glass as the car warms up anyway. While doing that you just bump the wiper with the ice scraper and it comes loose from the glass.

Might be cold enough to not be as big of an issue. Living most of my life in central Illinois, now south-central Wisconsin, almost everybody lifts the wipers. It's often warm enough when the snow starts to do a lot of melting, or your car is hot from a commute. The snow will melt, then freeze during the night and royaly attach your wipers to the car.

If the car is already cold and the temps are below freezing, then you just get snow and the wipers don't freeze, or just a small amount of ice if the car is warm but it's well below freezing. That's why I said it might be cold enough where you are to not be an issue.

Other reason is freezing rain is quite common in northern Illinois/southern Wisconsin. 1/4" of solid ice and you won't have wipers for 30 minutes until your car can melt it or you can attempt to dig them out but you're liable to damage the rubber trying that.

[2manytoyz]

This was late May near Mount Rushmore. Weren't expecting snow!

Our A/C had a heat strip, and we used a propane heater too. Zero insulation on a Popup, but inside temp was in the 50s. In the mid 20s at night. No outside tanks or plumbing, so that wasn't a factor. We had a porta-potti, and used the campground facilities. Nice thing was there were plenty of campsites to choose!

Our last TT had exposed tanks, and I ordered it with tank heater pads. Basically a peel and stick product. It's wired into 12V, and is rated for the temps you mentioned.



We did take this to North Georgia, and had freezing temps overnight. The campground required all water hoses to be disconnected before sundown. The truck had frost the next morning.



While we had no problem with the tanks, my propane regulator quit at 0 dark thirty. The camper was cold inside, we could see our breath. But I always plan for contingencies. I plugged in the 1500W ceramic heater and we went back to sleep. That had no problem keeping the camper warm. Turns out the first propane tank emptied due to using the furnace, and the shuttle valve stuck halfway when switching to the other tank. Couldn't use either tank, didn't have a spare regulator. But as luck would have it, there was a Camping World not far away. Picked one up that day, good to go.



Our current motorhome has tanks inside the belly of the rig. It uses air from the furnace to warm the tanks, and has the same sort of heating pads as shown on the travel trailer. Hoping we make a cold weather trip sometime soon. "Cold" is a relative term to those of us in FL.

[campbikemom]

profdant139 wrote:
And one more thought -- we are not hijacking the thread here. This is all relevant to "how cold can you go," the OP's topic. How does one cope with winter weather?

It's not really relevant to what I was asking, but I certainly don't mind :-).

As long as it's cold enough to not be DAMP, down is the way to go for sleeping bags and jackets.

The old adage of layers, layers, layers. No cotton anything. Wool baselayers. Insulated boots. Good gloves and hats. When we're "still" I'll wear my knee length down coat. When doing physical activity I wear very little - base layers with a thin pair of insulated pants (biking, cross-country skiing gear). Usually a wool shortsleeve over a technical long sleeve with a thin windproof vest and a thin jacket over. Depending on how much exertion I'll be putting out in the beginning might also have on my Patagonia Nanopuff, but I usually get hot pretty quickly in that. Basically I try to stay slightly on the cool side the whole time so I don't sweat a lot so stops aren't brutal.

In the tent sleeping days (hopefully in a few years we'll be back with the kids doing some of that) we'd dig down into the snow some to create a wind barrier. Fill thermos bottles with hot water before bed and throw them in the bottom of the sleeping bag. Always wear a thin hat to bed and layer from there depending on how good your sleeping bag is. I find 800-fill down is good for me into the teens at night in a tent. Marmot is my go-to brand for down sleeping bags.

[campbikemom]

CavemanCharlie wrote:

campbikemom wrote:

profdant139 wrote:
A member just PMed me to ask about the wiper blades in that photo. I move them away from the glass when snow is in the forecast. That way, they don't freeze to the windshield.

You can imagine how I learned about that trick. Yep -- one time, I froze 'em, and then saw that other folks had pivoted them away from the glass. (Bear in mind that I am a Californian, not used to freezing weather. My guess is that small children in North Dakota learn about how to avoid "wiper freeze" before they start kindergarten.)

It's funny to me being in the snowiest city in North America to even think that people don't know that purpose. I need to remember at one point I also lived in the high desert where when it snows it melts within 12 hours.

I've lived in SW MN all my life. It is quite cold and snowy here. I've never seen anyone do this. I'm not sure why you would ? What does it hurt if they freeze to the windshield? You have to chip the ice and snow off of the glass as the car warms up anyway. While doing that you just bump the wiper with the ice scraper and it comes loose from the glass.

SW MN gets about 3' of snow a year. Where I live averages 12', and just north of me over 300" a year. Not even comparable. Repeated (as in daily) snowfall chunks of ice that don't want to melt away and ruin your wiperblades quickly get built up. Keeping your wipers out saves you a step of having to pull them out when you're scraping your windshield and the lower portion where your hood and windshield meet. Also, when you are warming your car with that much snow on it the snow starts to melt underneath, but it stays cold enough on the top layer so it just starts turning to ice. Unless you have the encapsulated wiper blades they loose flexibility and don't clear as well.

[shum02]

profdant139 wrote:
And one more thought -- we are not hijacking the thread here. This is all relevant to "how cold can you go," the OP's topic. How does one cope with winter weather?

One finds winter things to do. Provincial parks here in Ontario have snow shoeing, cross country skiing, ice skating, sledding, fat tire mtb access and access to snowmobile trails.

Lots to do!

[OleManOleCan]

Years ago We camped some in cold weather and snow.
I disconnected the White hose and drained the Grey water before dark.
I left the taps open...
I had a 5 gallon jug of water in the camper.
I run the heat and had the cabinets open.
We had truck Sunscreens cut to fit our windows. Held in heat a little better.
We carried extra blankets for the beds.

I also hooked up to our batteries to keep them up.
My camping then was pre Led lights.
We ran a couple of lights as needed.

[profdant139]

And one more thought -- we are not hijacking the thread here. This is all relevant to "how cold can you go," the OP's topic. How does one cope with winter weather?

[profdant139]

Caveman Charlie, I can tell you from painful personal experience that if the wipers are left on the glass, and if the glass is above freezing, and wet snow falls on the wiper blades, you can get some very thick ice binding the wiper to the glass. It takes a lot more than a bump to free the wiper blade.

Maybe because it is so much colder in Minnesota, that does not happen? It surely does in the Sierra Nevada of California. I see folks pull their wipers away from the glass whenever snow is in the forecast and have learned my lesson.

Apparently, there are wiper manufacturers that recommend this procedure, at least according to this article:

Lift those blades, they say

But let me be the first to say that I am NOT an expert -- I am a warm weather flatlander who sometimes travels to high altitude. So if this is all bad advice, I am wide open to a counter-argument!!

[CavemanCharlie]

BobsYourUncle wrote:

CavemanCharlie wrote:

BobsYourUncle wrote:
I was FT in my TT for 2 Alberta winters. .....snip :B

You make it sound easy but, didn't you underwear freeze to the wall of your camper ??? Maybe the kid might not enjoy that at his age. :B

:B some of you guys have good memories - Haha!
Yes, I had my undies freeze to the wall inside the compartment I stored my laundry in. Kinda funny actually.

I guess all I'm saying is it's about attitude. I was determined to make it work, so I did. My situation at that time was something I posted very little about. It was a story in itself.

I chose to focus on all the reasons why I could FT in minus 30s weather rather than dwelling on why I couldn't. And besides that, I have always loved a challenge, something I can do when people tell me it won't work. That's just part of who I am...
🙂

I remember the story because you told it in a humors way. I'll never forget that story.

I agree with you about attitude. I was camping once at a local park this year and the park was almost empty because the forecast had said rain and everyone canceled out. About the time the sun went down the skies cleared and those of us that were still camping jumped out of our campers made bonfires and had a good time. As I sat cooking over my fire I felt sorry for all the people that had canceled just because of the forecast. They missed a beautiful night.

[CavemanCharlie]

campbikemom wrote:

profdant139 wrote:
A member just PMed me to ask about the wiper blades in that photo. I move them away from the glass when snow is in the forecast. That way, they don't freeze to the windshield.

You can imagine how I learned about that trick. Yep -- one time, I froze 'em, and then saw that other folks had pivoted them away from the glass. (Bear in mind that I am a Californian, not used to freezing weather. My guess is that small children in North Dakota learn about how to avoid "wiper freeze" before they start kindergarten.)

It's funny to me being in the snowiest city in North America to even think that people don't know that purpose. I need to remember at one point I also lived in the high desert where when it snows it melts within 12 hours.

I've lived in SW MN all my life. It is quite cold and snowy here. I've never seen anyone do this. I'm not sure why you would ? What does it hurt if they freeze to the windshield? You have to chip the ice and snow off of the glass as the car warms up anyway. While doing that you just bump the wiper with the ice scraper and it comes loose from the glass.

[campbikemom]

profdant139 wrote:
A member just PMed me to ask about the wiper blades in that photo. I move them away from the glass when snow is in the forecast. That way, they don't freeze to the windshield.

You can imagine how I learned about that trick. Yep -- one time, I froze 'em, and then saw that other folks had pivoted them away from the glass. (Bear in mind that I am a Californian, not used to freezing weather. My guess is that small children in North Dakota learn about how to avoid "wiper freeze" before they start kindergarten.)

It's funny to me being in the snowiest city in North America to even think that people don't know that purpose. I need to remember at one point I also lived in the high desert where when it snows it melts within 12 hours.

[spoon059]

RobWNY wrote:
If you find a campground, why not just winterize the camper, bring bottled water for drinking and cooking, and use the campground facilities for everything else. then you can just concentrate on having a great time and don't have to worry about anything happening to the camper.

That's what we did before kids. We've camped in the Poconos in early December when it never got above freezing. We've camped in NYC in mid December when it never got above freezing. A case of bottled water inside the camper and you get spots close to the bath house for toileting and showering needs. I'd suggest a nice robe for post shower walks though.

We LOVED those camping trips (again... before kids). We had a little 22' Nash and a single 1500 watt electric heater kept the camper comfy inside. Now with a 7 and 4 year old and a 9 month old, I wouldn't want to be stuck in our camper with it being too cold for them to go outside and play or have to worry about bathing and toileting them all the time.

[DutchmenSport]

campbikemom wrote:
Guys, my question was strictly related to whether the pipes and tanks would survive if we camped with water. ...

My strongest advice for you is this: if you have ANY doubts or concerns at all... winterize your water and sewage systems in your camper. And then if you want to continue using the camper with no water on-board, adjust your camping style.

Repairs are a pain in the neck if you pull the wrong card here. It's better to take the absolute known card (water freezes at 32 degrees) than gamble on getting the Ace and end up loosing in the end. Besides, camping with no running water a time or two will help expand your camping skills. It will help make you more adaptable, teach you something, and provide a stepping stone to use your camper a whole LOT more in cold weather. You may grow to like it better than warm weather camping. You won't know until you try!

Good luck! Happy birthday to the little tyke!

[Vintage465]

profdant139 wrote:
Everyone makes it sound like snow camping is about suffering. But what about the pleasure of sitting at the breakfast table with a cup of hot coffee, looking out the window at the new-fallen snow, while boondocking way back in the forest?

Kind of like this:


Click For Full-Size Image.

I agree! We camp all year! Rain is the only thing that is kind of a pain cause it can get kind messy and there is usually not much sunlight to keep the solar pumping out watts and keep the batteries up.

[Vintage465]

We boondocked @ 16-18 degrees at night, 28-30's during the day. Had zero issues for 3-4 days running the furnace and maintaining off solar. Then we moved to a location that got as low as 7 degrees one night and was around 10-14 the rest of the time. The one night it was 7 degrees, there was an area that was unheated in the cabinets that the hot and cold froze. I'd need to dig a little to get to it and insulate it. Once I opened the cabinets and heated things up a bit it loosened up and we had water.