3 tons
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Checking the reviews on the Renogy site I found at least two fellas that say they use the 2000w PSW to run microwaves, coffee makers and resistance heaters, but don’t say what oven wattage, nor is a duration spec provided…On their other 2000w PSW inverter-charger they do list the duration at 1 sec which comes up a bit short compared to the 5sec on my ProSine 2000w PSW, but 1 sec sounds about right at that price point… If you think about a 60 cycle waveform, 1 sec would likely be sufficient for a smaller sized microwave, but in my mind doubtful for an inductive motor load like a compressor - JMO
https://www.renogy.com/2000w-12v-pure-sine-wave-inverter/
3 tons
Upon edit, a same rating, like-kind Aims inverter list surge at 4000w/duration at 40ms - I wouldn’t be surprised if they came out if the same Wuhan factory…
https://www.aimscorp.net/documents/PWRI200012120S%20022222.pdf
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StirCrazy
Kamloops, BC, Canada
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otrfun wrote:StirCrazy wrote:otrfun wrote:
IMO the most important takeaway when discussing inrush, starting, peak, or surge, current is the following: unless a specific time or duration (or testing standard/protocol) is specified for any given current rating, the current rating provides little insight into how the device will perform in the realworld. I do agree the lack of companies putting this in there advertising makes things a little more difficult. personaly I have never been met with any issues when I email the company and ask for that information. You mentioned the Renogy 2000w PSW inverter. Very popular unit. Always wondered what time/duration they used for their peak rating. Did you happen to get this info?
not yet. I was actualy going to email them and see after what you said the other day. hang on I'll email them now and let you know.
Steve
2014 F350 6.7 Platinum
2016 Cougar 330RBK
1991 Slumberqueen WS100
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StirCrazy
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StirCrazy wrote:otrfun wrote:StirCrazy wrote:otrfun wrote:
IMO the most important takeaway when discussing inrush, starting, peak, or surge, current is the following: unless a specific time or duration (or testing standard/protocol) is specified for any given current rating, the current rating provides little insight into how the device will perform in the realworld. I do agree the lack of companies putting this in there advertising makes things a little more difficult. personaly I have never been met with any issues when I email the company and ask for that information. You mentioned the Renogy 2000w PSW inverter. Very popular unit. Always wondered what time/duration they used for their peak rating. Did you happen to get this info?
not yet. I was actualy going to email them and see after what you said the other day. hang on I'll email them now and let you know. I have a go power 2000watt inverter in the 5th wheel and it has never had an issue running anything. I think it actualy started my ac once by accident haha.. but I am looking at the renogy for the camper.
Steve
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otrfun
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theoldwizard1 wrote:On refrigeration equipment you might find "locked rotor amperage" (LRA) which would be worse than normal inrush current. Sorry, have to respectfully disagree. One cannot be any "worse" or better than the other since they both, more or less, describe the same thing.
Air conditioner manufacturers use LRA to quantify the inrush current drawn by the compressor motor at its rated voltage when the rotor is kept stationary. Or, put another way, LRA quantifies the inrush current necessary to place a stationary or locked rotor in a compressor motor in motion.
theoldwizard1 wrote:No manufacturer specs their in rush current. Agree, it's not very common for manufacturers to use the term inrush current when providing specs for their products. The primary reason is because inrush current is a general descriptor for a short, momentary burst (or inrush) of current. The time/duration for measuring inrush current can vary for RV a/c compressors and small household motors as opposed to large commercial equipment.
Inrush current, in terms of starting RV a/c compressors and smaller consumer-type AC motors, is typically measured in less than a second. A Fluke or Amprobe inrush current capable clamp-on ammeter bears this out because it provides inrush current results in less than second. The time/duration for the inrush current analysis is less than a second, but obviously much longer than what's required for a peak reading.
With that being said . . . if an inverter or inverter generator manufacturer specifies current and time/duration at multiple power levels, one can use this data to approximate inrush current performance. For example, a 2000 watt inverter (with a 2000 watt "continuous" power rating) that also has a 4000 watt *peak* power rating will probably provide minimal inrush current. A 2000 watt inverter that can also output 4000 watts for 1-2 seconds should provide excellent inrush current. A 2000 watt inverter that is capable of producing 4000 watts for 5-10 seconds (and/or 6000 watts for 1-2 seconds) should provide outstanding inrush current.
Hope this helps.
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otrfun
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pianotuna wrote:I can tell you that inrush on a 1000 watt psw inverter is high enough to blow a 30 amp fuse. And that is with no load. DAMHIK I believe you're talking about the current encountered on the INPUT of the inverter when it's connected to a power source without first precharging the inverter caps with a resistor.
Yup, been there, done that--lol!
Note: This is not to be confused with the inrush current produced on the OUTPUT of the inverter---which is the topic currently being discussed.
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StirCrazy
Kamloops, BC, Canada
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otrfun wrote:theoldwizard1 wrote:On refrigeration equipment you might find "locked rotor amperage" (LRA) which would be worse than normal inrush current. Sorry, have to respectfully disagree. One cannot be any "worse" or better than the other since they both, more or less, describe the same thing.
Air conditioner manufacturers use LRA to quantify the inrush current drawn by the compressor motor at its rated voltage when the rotor is kept stationary. Or, put another way, LRA quantifies the inrush current necessary to place a stationary or locked rotor in a compressor motor in motion.
theoldwizard1 wrote:No manufacturer specs their in rush current. Agree, it's not very common for manufacturers to use the term inrush current when providing specs for their products. The primary reason is because inrush current is a general descriptor for a short, momentary burst (or inrush) of current. The time/duration for measuring inrush current can vary for RV a/c compressors and small household motors as opposed to large commercial equipment.
Inrush current, in terms of starting RV a/c compressors and smaller consumer-type AC motors, is typically measured in less than a second. A Fluke or Amprobe inrush current capable clamp-on ammeter bears this out because it provides inrush current results in less than second. The time/duration for the inrush current analysis is less than a second, but obviously much longer than what's required for a peak reading.
With that being said . . . if an inverter or inverter generator manufacturer specifies current and time/duration at multiple power levels, one can use this data to approximate inrush current performance. For example, a 2000 watt inverter (with a 2000 watt "continuous" power rating) that also has a 4000 watt *peak* power rating will probably provide minimal inrush current. A 2000 watt inverter that can also output 4000 watts for 1-2 seconds should provide excellent inrush current. A 2000 watt inverter that is capable of producing 4000 watts for 5-10 seconds (and/or 6000 watts for 1-2 seconds) should provide outstanding inrush current.
Hope this helps.
ok so here are the specs. once again renogy customer service was quick and efficient. so there is two specs one for max power (4000watts) and one for overload protection. so it will handle the max power (4000watts) for 5 seconds and if it hits a overload conditions that will trip the inverter to protect it with in 40milli seconds.
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otrfun
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StirCrazy wrote:ok so here are the specs. once again renogy customer service was quick and efficient. so there is two specs one for max power (4000watts) and one for overload protection. so it will handle the max power (4000watts) for 5 seconds and if it hits a overload conditions that will trip the inverter to protect it with in 40milli seconds. You didn't state the model number. I would assume that's for the Renogy low-frequency 2000 watt inverter which costs about $600 and weighs about 50 lbs., right? That toroidal coil, which helps provide all the inrush current, makes for a heavy unit. Specs for most of these 2000 watt low-frequency inverters are somewhat similar in terms of their power/duration specs.
The high-frequency Renogy 2000 watt inverter, which costs about $300 and weighs 12 lbs. only has a 4000 watt peak rating as far as I can tell. My guess, the peak rating means it will only output 4000 watts for 20-40 milliseconds. Not enough time to produce much inrush current. I believe this is the unit the OP was looking at purchasing.
The Xantrex 2000 watt Freedom X inverter, which I believe is also a high-frequency unit (at 15 lbs.), will output 4000 watts >2 sec. Xantrex states specifically it's very effective for starting motors. That's an awesome spec for a high-frequency inverter.
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3 tons
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5 sec seems a uber robust number for a lower price point HF inverter - I’d need to see the spec to believe it - JMHO
3 tons
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StirCrazy
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otrfun wrote:StirCrazy wrote:ok so here are the specs. once again renogy customer service was quick and efficient. so there is two specs one for max power (4000watts) and one for overload protection. so it will handle the max power (4000watts) for 5 seconds and if it hits a overload conditions that will trip the inverter to protect it with in 40milli seconds. You didn't state the model number. I would assume that's for the Renogy low-frequency 2000 watt inverter which costs about $600 and weighs about 50 lbs., right? That toroidal coil, which helps provide all the inrush current, makes for a heavy unit. Specs for most of these 2000 watt low-frequency inverters are somewhat similar in terms of their power/duration specs.
The high-frequency Renogy 2000 watt inverter, which costs about $300 and weighs 12 lbs. only has a 4000 watt peak rating as far as I can tell. My guess, the peak rating means it will only output 4000 watts for 20-40 milliseconds. Not enough time to produce much inrush current. I believe this is the unit the OP was looking at purchasing.
The Xantrex 2000 watt Freedom X inverter, which I believe is also a high-frequency unit (at 15 lbs.), will output 4000 watts >2 sec. Xantrex states specifically it's very effective for starting motors. That's an awesome spec for a high-frequency inverter.
no, it is thier one that is on sale for 369 cdn right now and includes battery cables and a remot control
2000W 12V Pure Sine Wave Inverter
SKU: RNG-INVT-2000-12V-P2-CA
Steve
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otrfun
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StirCrazy wrote:no, it is thier one that is on sale for 369 cdn right now and includes battery cables and a remot control
2000W 12V Pure Sine Wave Inverter
SKU: RNG-INVT-2000-12V-P2-CA
Steve Thanks for clarifying, Steve. I have no reason to doubt you were quoted 4000 watts for 5 sec. I've had all kinds of specs and claims quoted to me over the years.
Interesting that Renogy fails to advertise this outstanding capability anywhere in writing. All their online literature and specs simply claim a generic 4000 watt *peak* surge/power rating.
For the sake of discussion, I will say this: *IF* this $300 (US) 2000 watt Renogy RNG-INVT-2000-12V-P2-US inverter is capable of 4000w for 5 sec, it would make it one of the best performing high-frequency 2000w inverters on the market, regardless of price.
Unfortunately, this is a huge if. As they say, if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is.
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