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Best digital amplifier for existing antenna

TCI
Explorer
Explorer
We have a Windgard Sensar III Antenna on our 2015 Montana. We want to upgrade it to a digital amplifier but be able to mount the new amplifier on the existing antenna pole. So what would be the best digital amplifier to purchase. Thanks all for your help.
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Fulltiming since Oct 06 - Sold the Stick House
27 REPLIES 27

SoundGuy
Explorer
Explorer
MNtundraRet wrote:
You all seem to forgetting something here.

My normal everyday range is still double yours. 100 to 125 miles.


No, no one is "forgetting", we just don't believe it. :W Even Winegard doesn't make such fantastical claims. ๐Ÿ˜‰
2012 Silverado 1500 Crew Cab
2014 Coachmen Freedom Express 192RBS
2003 Fleetwood Yuma * 2008 K-Z Spree 240BH-LX
2007 TrailCruiser C21RBH * 2000 Fleetwood Santa Fe
1998 Jayco 10UD * 1969 Coleman CT380

MNtundraRet
Navigator
Navigator
You all seem to forgetting something here.

My normal everyday range is still double yours. 100 to 125 miles.
Mark & Jan "Old age & treachery win over youth & enthusiasm"
2003 Fleetwood Jamboree 29

SoundGuy
Explorer
Explorer
MNtundraRet wrote:
By the way; I picked up 63 channels with one search last week in Lac Qui Parle State Park near Montevideo MN. Just the right condition with rain clouds, and just after sun-set. Of course most channels dissapear after clouds move out.


Dutch_12078 wrote:
How many channels are received reliably is what I suspect most of us care about in a given area. Not the odd atmospheric bounces that serve no real purpose beyond bragging rights...


Exactly ... I only care about dead solid reception, anything less is useless and counts for nothing.
2012 Silverado 1500 Crew Cab
2014 Coachmen Freedom Express 192RBS
2003 Fleetwood Yuma * 2008 K-Z Spree 240BH-LX
2007 TrailCruiser C21RBH * 2000 Fleetwood Santa Fe
1998 Jayco 10UD * 1969 Coleman CT380

Dutch_12078
Explorer
Explorer
MNtundraRet wrote:

By the way; I picked up 63 channels with one search last week in Lac Qui Parle State Park near Montevideo MN. Just the right condition with rain clouds, and just after sun-set. Of course most channels dissapear after clouds move out.

How many channels are received reliably is what I suspect most of us care about in a given area. Not the odd atmospheric bounces that serve no real purpose beyond bragging rights...
Dutch
2001 GBM Landau 34' Class A
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2011 Toyota RAV4 4WD/Remco pump
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MNtundraRet
Navigator
Navigator
For those questioning my range, evidently none of you have ever read the manuals for passing the HAM license.

You would understand how cloud cover and other conditions can allow for signal bounce. The Sun is your worst culprit. Best time to search for signals is night time or mid-day. Rising and setting Sun cause the most interference.

Also: LED lights, fluoresent lights, exhaust fans, microwave use, all mess with the signal.


I have logged all channels picked up from different locations in the past. Just like the old days for shortwave on my Hammerlund HQ180 receiver.


Rather than argue on the forum I prefer to help those who always show up to ask how I am getting chennels when they can't. Those not willing to think "out of the box" are the only real losers. You can read my old posts if you care.


By the way; I picked up 63 channels with one search last week in Lac Qui Parle State Park near Montevideo MN. Just the right condition with rain clouds, and just after sun-set. Of course most channels dissapear after clouds move out.
Mark & Jan "Old age & treachery win over youth & enthusiasm"
2003 Fleetwood Jamboree 29

wa8yxm
Explorer III
Explorer III
THe Band Plan for what used to be channels 2 to 69 or even 83.. Well the 2007 plan did not work out so they keep re-drawing and re-drawing and re-drawing and I dont knwo what it will end up beind.

They keep trying to steal frequencies from me as well.
Home was where I park it. but alas the.
2005 Damon Intruder 377 Alas declared a total loss
after a semi "nicked" it. Still have the radios
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Dutch_12078
Explorer
Explorer
If you want to know which channels are going where, not going anywhere, or going off the air, here's an excellent resource:

Repack channel chart
Dutch
2001 GBM Landau 34' Class A
F53 chassis, Triton V10, TST TPMS
Bigfoot Automatic Leveling System
2011 Toyota RAV4 4WD/Remco pump
ReadyBrute Elite tow bar/Blue Ox baseplate

SoundGuy
Explorer
Explorer
MNtundraRet wrote:
My typical range is 125 miles (clear day) to 150 to 200 miles at night or cloudy conditions.


LarryJM wrote:
As the above post mentioned that must be some unusual trasmission towers since the line of sight for an antenna 5000 feet high is only 86miles and then you have to consider just the signal attenuation for the mandated extra low power transmission limits over those extreme distances. In fact the LOS for an antenna 10,000 ft (almost 2 miles high) is only just over 122mi less than you stated typical 125 mi range you quoted.


Since the tallest television transmitting antennas in the world rarely even exceed 2000' any antenna 5000' or 10000' high would have to gain it's elevation by being located on a mountain. According to TV Fool I'm a mere 28 miles from the 1815' tall CN Tower in Toronto and as would be expected signal strength is quite good but I likewise have pretty good success receiving Buffalo transmitters which range from 50 to 75 miles from here, no doubt only because much of that pathway from there to here is over Lake Ontario, along with the fact I'm running a Winegard Sensar IV plus a Winegard SignalPro. 125 to 200 mile reception is pure fantasy. :R
2012 Silverado 1500 Crew Cab
2014 Coachmen Freedom Express 192RBS
2003 Fleetwood Yuma * 2008 K-Z Spree 240BH-LX
2007 TrailCruiser C21RBH * 2000 Fleetwood Santa Fe
1998 Jayco 10UD * 1969 Coleman CT380

LarryJM
Explorer
Explorer
MNtundraRet wrote:
I hate to bust your bubble here, but I have been using a Radio Shack adjustable in-line RF amplifier (2 to 10 dBs of additional gain) since 2007.

It connects to output side of Winegard amplifier and straight to the television on RG6u coaxial cable. It gives me up to 20 dBs gain (adjustable from 12 to 20).

I used to have the Winegard III with Wingman, but converted head to Winegard Razar after headwinds bent the old head.

My typical range is 125 miles (clear day) to 150 to 200 miles at night or cloudy conditions. Over-power is rare since you can either cut gain, or move antenna off direct aim on strong transmitters.

You can check my old posts here for more information, if the archives have been straightened out since last year. ๐Ÿ˜‰


Well I guess you can put me into the Doubting Thomas group and from all I know your results are sure not typical nor do they conform to the physics concerning amplifiers, noise, typical UHF ranges as I understand them. As the above post mentioned that must be some unusual trasmission towers since the line of sight for an antenna 5000 feet high is only 86miles and then you have to consider just the signal attenuation for the mandated extra low power transmission limits over those extreme distances. In fact the LOS for an antenna 10,000 ft (almost 2 miles high) is only just over 122mi less than you stated typical 125 mi range you quoted.

IMO your post definitely needs the footnote that "RESULTS NOT TYPICAL NOR SHOULD BE EXPECTED"

Larry
2001 standard box 7.3L E-350 PSD Van with 4.10 rear and 2007 Holiday Rambler Aluma-Lite 8306S Been RV'ing since 1974.
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GordonThree
Explorer
Explorer
Those must be impressive towers you're aiming at 200 miles away.
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MNtundraRet
Navigator
Navigator
I hate to bust your bubble here, but I have been using a Radio Shack adjustable in-line RF amplifier (2 to 10 dBs of additional gain) since 2007.

It connects to output side of Winegard amplifier and straight to the television on RG6u coaxial cable. It gives me up to 20 dBs gain (adjustable from 12 to 20).

I used to have the Winegard III with Wingman, but converted head to Winegard Razar after headwinds bent the old head.

My typical range is 125 miles (clear day) to 150 to 200 miles at night or cloudy conditions. Over-power is rare since you can either cut gain, or move antenna off direct aim on strong transmitters.

You can check my old posts here for more information, if the archives have been straightened out since last year. ๐Ÿ˜‰
Mark & Jan "Old age & treachery win over youth & enthusiasm"
2003 Fleetwood Jamboree 29

LarryJM
Explorer
Explorer
theoldwizard1 wrote:
kerrlakeRoo wrote:
Your just receiving a signal, and you're boosting it already, ...

100% correct The little protrusions or other parts of an antenna are cut to a specific length to "resonate" with frequency in a given range. This resonation is the "boost" that kerrlakeRoo is referring to.


That might be your belief, but my is completely different. While the various element lengths are designed based the best compromise for the expected wavelengths of the frequency of interested they don't really resonate. What these "antenna elements" determine is the beam pattern which in essence rejects off frequency signals. This is extremely important since this gives the antenna the ability to have a much higher signal to noise ratio that a omni or non directional antenna. the "boost" kerrlakeRoo is referring to I believe is the amplifier found in most all of the Wineguard antennas. One thing that is something I think one needs to keep in mind is that any amplifier except for the very, very high end ($100s of not $1000) is they amplify both the signal of interest along with any noise and most generate additional noise within their electronics. This "noise" with CW signals results in "snow", but depending of many factors can actually make or break the detection of a digital signal and you can also over drive many TV receivers with too much digital signal which can cause problems.

Larry
2001 standard box 7.3L E-350 PSD Van with 4.10 rear and 2007 Holiday Rambler Aluma-Lite 8306S Been RV'ing since 1974.
RAINKAP INSTALL////ETERNABOND INSTALL

Tom_M1
Explorer
Explorer
Presently about 25% of the stations are broadcasting on the VHF band. After repacking, this percentage will most likely increase. It's important to have an antenna that will perform well for VHF. About the only one that will do this is the Winegard Sensor IV.
Tom
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theoldwizard1
Explorer
Explorer
Dutch_12078 wrote:

The current FCC mandated channel repack removes channels 37-50 from the broadcast TV spectrum. Broadcasters licensed for those channels that are not giving up their licenses will be relocated to broadcast channels 2-36. Many of those that are giving up their licenses will remain on the air by contracting with another licensee to use a sub-channel.



Thank you for correcting me ! I thought the FCC had already reclaimed VHF Band I and was discussing reclaiming Band III ! The only thing I found out about Band I is that "Digital television has problems with impulse noise interference, particularly in this band."

Given the smaller size if most "digital" antennas, I certainly would want to be in the UHF band !