FORD's New V-6 3.0L TD 250HP/440 Torque?

[bagman]

Ok, so in a few months one can order this new Ford Diesel in the F-150 and it offers towing ratings of over 11,000 lbs. So please tell me why FORD cannot offer this new diesel engine in the E-350 E-450 Cutaway RV chassis? I remember in 1996, our Tioga 31N 14,500 GVWR on a Chevy GP-30 chassis used by class C manufacturers and the Chevy 454 had 290 HP & 440 ft.lbs. of torque. This new diesel would solve two FORD issues: 1. Fuel Economy & 2. Interior leg room as the 3.0L TD would require a much smaller dog house! I just read about the Sprinter Chassis issues, with respect to Unibody Constructions and availability of parts and using only specific lubricants. Quite frankly, if I was to purchase a B+ motor home, I think the FORD Transit with the inline 5 cycl. would be a better option than the Sprinter, because it gets better fuel economy, puts out more Torque, and FORD dealerships are a dime a dozen, meaning they are everywhere. I just wish someone would come up with a class B+ of C that has sufficient room, a queen walk around queen bed, and a min of 15 MPG. Another issue I have with the Sprinter, RAM ProMaster, & FORD Transit is the approx. 25 Gal. fuel tank. Our 1996 Tioga Class C had a 60 Gal fuel tank vs 55 Gal offered by FORD. What say you?

[rjstractor]

bagman wrote:
So, I just got done reading at tfltruck.com that Chevy introduced at the North American Auto show a 1/2 ton Silverado a 3.0 L TD Duramax inline 6 cycl. mated to a 10 Speed auto tranny and doing in excess of 30MPG. Got to believe that. I think that is the same motor Isuzu/Chevy/GMC uses in the cabover commercial del trucks, so why can't this motor pull a B+ motor home of 12,000 GVWR down the road. It would certainly be stronger than the V-6 TD that the Sprinter uses on their RV chassis!

The Isuzu NPR motors are inline 4s. The 3L would be fine in a motorhome application but at 150 hp and 282 ft/lbs torque performance would lag behind the Transit or Sprinter. The NPR HD uses a bigger engine (5.2L inline 4) with 210/452 that would outperform either one but you're looking at a much bigger, heavier engine.

[bagman]

I found that same inline 3.0L TD Isuzu website and it is being used in a 13,000 GVWR commercial cabover Isuzu NPR delivery truck. G.M. & Isuzu have a very close arrangement with Isuzu offering the G.M. 6.0 V-8 as an option on the Cabover commercial vehicles. Bags.

[bagman]

So, I just got done reading at tfltruck.com that Chevy introduced at the North American Auto show a 1/2 ton Silverado a 3.0 L TD Duramax inline 6 cycl. mated to a 10 Speed auto tranny and doing in excess of 30MPG. Got to believe that. I think that is the same motor Isuzu/Chevy/GMC uses in the cabover commercial del trucks, so why can't this motor pull a B+ motor home of 12,000 GVWR down the road. It would certainly be stronger than the V-6 TD that the Sprinter uses on their RV chassis!

[bagman]

I just read on tfltruck.com that the F-150 will achieve 30 MPG with the new Ford V-6 3.0L TD. A mile more per gallon that the RAM 1/2 Ton.

[valhalla360]

GWolfe wrote:
I would guess the Ecoboost wouldn't get that great of mileage in a B+ or C since it would be relying on the turbos much of the time to keep the thing moving. The Ecoboosts are great in the pick ups because most of the time they are not spooling the turbos as much to move around a relatively light pick up. Look at the MPGs of an Ecoboost towing a TT to get an idea of the MPGs you would get in a B+ or C.

I'm sure an Ecoboost would power one well just not get much better mileage than the V-10.

I think this is the real reason.

A 1/2ton pickup at cruise speed going down the highway, might need 60-70hp which the little V6 can do easily without activating the turbo. That leaves it running at a very efficient power output maximizing MPG but for occasional hard acceleration or occasionally pulling a trailer, it can put out the power all be it at lower MPG.

A 30' class C pulling a car is probably going to need 150+HP to maintain freeway speeds, so engine will always be kicking up into the range where the turbo is going and the MPG will reflect this.

[RobertRyan]

bagman wrote:
Ok, so in a few months one can order this new Ford Diesel in the F-150 and it offers towing ratings of over 11,000 lbs. So please tell me why FORD cannot offer this new diesel engine in the E-350 E-450 Cutaway RV chassis? I remember in 1996, our Tioga 31N 14,500 GVWR on a Chevy GP-30 chassis used by class C manufacturers and the Chevy 454 had 290 HP & 440 ft.lbs. of torque. This new diesel would solve two FORD issues: 1. Fuel Economy & 2. Interior leg room as the 3.0L TD would require a much smaller dog house! I just read about the Sprinter Chassis issues, with respect to Unibody Constructions and availability of parts and using only specific lubricants. Quite frankly, if I was to purchase a B+ motor home, I think the FORD Transit with the inline 5 cycl. would be a better option than the Sprinter, because it gets better fuel economy, puts out more Torque, and FORD dealerships are a dime a dozen, meaning they are everywhere. I just wish someone would come up with a class B+ of C that has sufficient room, a queen walk around queen bed, and a min of 15 MPG. Another issue I have with the Sprinter, RAM ProMaster, & FORD Transit is the approx. 25 Gal. fuel tank. Our 1996 Tioga Class C had a 60 Gal fuel tank vs 55 Gal offered by FORD. What say you?

I have seen these figures and what the ACTUAL ratings are is a good question. Closest match would be the IVECO Daily 72c with a 23750lb GCVWR and 7,700lb towing.
Those F150 figures would be severely downrated here. Current 3.5 Ecoboost F150 is rated at 8,200lb on a 70mm hitch

[theoldwizard1]

bagman wrote:
This new diesel would solve two FORD issues: 1. Fuel Economy & 2. Interior leg room as the 3.0L TD would require a much smaller dog house!

The current E350/450 chassis and sheet metal are hold over from the last generation. Ford is not likely to invest money in changing either of those items for the few thousand vehicles a month that they sell.

bagman wrote:
Quite frankly, if I was to purchase a B+ motor home, I think the FORD Transit with the inline 5 cycl. would be a better option than the Sprinter, ...

Don't expect that 5 cylinder to be around for a long time. The new V6 will replace it, eventually. (Lower cost, more power)

[rjstractor]

bagman wrote:
It is more powerful!

On paper, yes. But you can't really compare the two engines. If the Ford Lion V6 were used in a commercial application it would almost certainly be detuned for the reasons Bryan cited in his post. If the Sprinter engine were tuned for a light duty application (like the F150) it would likely have similar power and torque specs to the Lion engine.

[bagman]

It is more powerful!

[Horizon170]

How does this new Ford V6 diesel compare to the Mercedes V6 diesel?
Marvin

[carringb]

Ok, so in a few months one can order this new Ford Diesel in the F-150 and it offers towing ratings of over 11,000 lbs. So please tell me why FORD cannot offer this new diesel engine in the E-350 E-450 Cutaway RV chassis?

Duty Cycle. This motor was tested under the light-truck test cycle, vs the the 3.2L which is in the Transit, which is tested under the Medium-vehicle test cycle. The 3.0 V6 would likely end up being severely detuned to meet the requirements of the more stringent medium-duty test cycle, at which point it probably wouldn't be any more powerful than the 3.2L.

Thats also the same reason why the 3.5L EcoBoost isn't offered in F250s. To meet the medium-duty test cycle to put it in the Transit, it was detuned to the point it no longer matches the 6.2L V8 for power, and once you add a lot of frontal area, the fuel economy benefit goes away.

On that note: The 6.2L V8 is now available in the E-series, although the V10 maintains superior tow ratings.

If you really want a diesel, and the Transit won't cut it, there is a company called ExpoVans which has a drop-in Cummins 6.7L package for the E-series.

E350 6.7L short vid

[GWolfe]

I would guess the Ecoboost wouldn't get that great of mileage in a B+ or C since it would be relying on the turbos much of the time to keep the thing moving. The Ecoboosts are great in the pick ups because most of the time they are not spooling the turbos as much to move around a relatively light pick up. Look at the MPGs of an Ecoboost towing a TT to get an idea of the MPGs you would get in a B+ or C.

I'm sure an Ecoboost would power one well just not get much better mileage than the V-10.

[rjstractor]

Two thoughts here, one, I don't think Ford will invest in any significant engineering for the Econoline, like a new diesel engine. Putting that V6 in a more HD version of the Transit cutaway would have the same effect though. Two, the Ecoboost V6 in its current form doesn't have the duty cycle rating to survive in a commercial application like a cutaway chassis. The Eco V6 in the Transit is derated significantly from the F150 version, and not even available in the Transit cutaway.

[bagman]

Ron, anything to make the FORD E series Doghouse smaller! But, your idea of replacing the 6.8 V-10 with a smaller V-6 Eco-Boost is an excellent idea. Personally I have bad knees and I need to be able to stretch out my legs! And we all want to be able to move from the cab to the main box of the class C or B+. Chuck.