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 > Ford finally releases specs for F-150 3.0L diesel

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VernDiesel

Dayton OH

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Posted: 01/13/18 04:12pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

I don’t think anyone will or at least should pick a 3.0 1/2 ton diesel over a half ton gasser or a 3/4 diesel purely on the cost differences in fuel expenses as you say. Most don’t pick their wife purely on looks. There had better be more put into that buying decision.


Transportn Airstreams TT boats Mfg 2 dealer RAM EcoDiesel factory brake controller tow mirrors hitch camera receiver 1,290/12k no-sway WDH Axle to frame air bags Tune w turbo brake, Max tow 9,200 CGAR 7,800 CVWR 15,950 axle weights 3,340 steer 2,260 drive

1stgenfarmboy

Southern tip of ILL

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Posted: 01/13/18 04:33pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

You are correct Vern, I picked my wife for her ability to pull a load, and thank goodness she never gets on here. [emoticon]





not really.....if you want to see someone God is trying to set a record for blessing just look at me and the person he gave me.

Looks
singing voice
sandwich making ability
CFO
mother
friend



I am truly blessed.


1993 Dodge W350 Cummins with all the goodies
2014 Ram 1500 Laramie Longhorn 2wd 395hp
2017 Forest River Surveyor 243 RBS
2001 Super Sherpa & 2012 DL650A go along also


spoon059

Just north of D.C.

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Posted: 01/13/18 04:58pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

1stgenfarmboy wrote:

I am truly blessed.
You and me both brother!!!


2015 Ram CTD
2015 Jayco 29QBS

FishOnOne

The Great State of Texas

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Posted: 01/13/18 05:38pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

spoon059 wrote:

OP, sorry about your truck. Keep us updated about how the dealer resolves the issue. I can't image the frustration you are dealing with. Brand new truck and this issue. I'm really surprised, I thought the newly redesigned fuel pump would have solved those issues. Truly frustrating.

In regards to those $70K diesel trucks, here is a 2017 Ram 4 door Cummins with a fair amount of options for $44K. I'm sure with less options you could do even better. Not sure where you guys are buying trucks, or how in the world you afford them... but $70K for a TRUCK? Unless I am making a living off that truck, I am not spending that kind of money. You can get a decent MDT hauler and drive commercial for that kind of money... insanity!!!
https://www.dennisdillonchryslerjeepdodge.com/new/Ram/2017-Ram-3500-Caldwell-boise-101762b20a0e0ae76cb81e67492cc902.htm


LMAO... This hater can't even get the right thread. [emoticon]


'12 Ford Super Duty FX4 ELD CC 6.7 PSD 400HP 800ft/lbs
"Built Ford Tough"
'16 Sprinter 319MKS "Wide Body"

ShinerBock

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Posted: 01/14/18 06:45pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Allamakee1 wrote:



I’ve stated what I intended to in regards to a 3.0 and to address your options from an actual 3.0 diesel owner for anyone interested in this situation. Obviously people can display data points to fit their agenda, but since there are no more valuable points to discuss/debate let’s let our debate die to get this back on topic. People can go back and read both of our opinions and let them make up their own minds for their own situations.


A lot of what I stated wasn't opinions. They were facts based on actual numbers that most(not just small percentages) truck customers experience. When one puts pen to paper the savings are not as big as they seem for most truck owners. This may not be the case since a small percentage of truck owners like you and I who drive a lot annually, but for most it isn't. I also did not use false or cherry picked data to make my point seem better like you did either. Most are comfortable paying an extra $25 or so dollars a month to have their 100+ hp, better performance, and better towing power. It is jut not that big of a gap to warrant it for most.

Since the main benefit of the small diesels is fuel mileage, they tend to no do so great when fuel prices are low like they have been and are predicting to be for a while. If they offerd more torque, capability, or pulling power like their HD truck brethren then I would see more being sold outside their small market. Essentially these small diesels are CAFE trucks intended to help the manufacturers meet strict fuel economy requirements by reducing their total fleet mileage numbers, nothing more.

Allamakee1

Iowa

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Posted: 01/14/18 08:17pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

VernDiesel wrote:

I don’t think anyone will or at least should pick a 3.0 1/2 ton diesel over a half ton gasser or a 3/4 diesel purely on the cost differences in fuel expenses as you say. Most don’t pick their wife purely on looks. There had better be more put into that buying decision.


I didn’t say that was the only reason. I seem to put more thought than some into my vehicle purchases. I needed a vehicle that got as good of mileage possible do to my commute, but also be able to pull my TT comfortably. It also would need space for my family and two bird hunting dogs. I also do a lot of deer hunting so a truck bed is a must. I did all of the figures over and over and came to this conclusion. Honestly the choice was too easy, because there wasn’t anything close. I spent the most time researching the reliability and possible problems with the Ram in general over picking the engine. Another factor I took into account is duration. I sold my old 05 Chevy with 200k so I tend to keep them for a while and the Diesel engine premium would make sense. I also purchased it very slightly used to reduce that initial depreciation hit and still have lots of time left on the factory warranty. I don’t think I need to explain my decision to you, but there it is anyway.

Allamakee1

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Posted: 01/14/18 08:29pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ShinerBock wrote:



A lot of what I stated wasn't opinions. They were facts based on actual numbers that most(not just small percentages) truck customers experience. When one puts pen to paper the savings are not as big as they seem for most truck owners. This may not be the case since a small percentage of truck owners like you and I who drive a lot annually, but for most it isn't. I also did not use false or cherry picked data to make my point seem better like you did either. Most are comfortable paying an extra $25 or so dollars a month to have their 100+ hp, better performance, and better towing power. It is jut not that big of a gap to warrant it most.


I didn’t cherry pick anything, I used the data you provided. You were the one who all the sudden argued with the data you provided. More people are putting pens to paper and making the efficient decisions, amazing that 4 individual auto makers are now making 1/2 ton diesels. I’m getting tired of arguing with you but I’ll respond if you continue to question my honesty and integrity. I explained my situation and my personal opinion, you are the one projecting your opinion on what the masses would prefer even though you don’t know their individual situation.

ShinerBock

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Posted: 01/14/18 09:24pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

Allamakee1 wrote:


I didn’t cherry pick anything, I used the data you provided. You were the one who all the sudden argued with the data you provided. More people are putting pens to paper and making the efficient decisions, amazing that 4 individual auto makers are now making 1/2 ton diesels. I’m getting tired of arguing with you but I’ll respond if you continue to question my honesty and integrity. I explained my situation and my personal opinion, you are the one projecting your opinion on what the masses would prefer even though you don’t know their individual situation.



Yes, you did. You cherry picked the fuel prices with the diesel and gas being the same price in your calculations even though it is much higher in most places and then you cherry picked the percentages of engines sold leaving out the 5.0L to make it look like more people preferred the economy engine.

Yes, you explained your situation and personal opinion just as I have explained mine which is that most would probably not be willing to give up that much power and capability for such little monetary gain. If the gain was greater(ie increase in fuel prices) then I can see it, but not if it remains less than $50 a month in savings.

So essentially, if you drive the average 16,550 miles most American male drives a year(LINK) and the gasoline prices in your area is the $2.50(current US average) and diesel was $2.99(current US average)(LINK). Then you to the average fuel mileage of the current 3.5L Ecoboost on fuelly which is 16.2 mpg(LINK) and then took the average for the Ecodiesel which is 22.4 mpg(LINK). That would give the average person a savings of $344.88 a year or just $28.74 a month on fuel alone.

Then add in the maintenance costs for both with the oil being about $120 for the Ecodiesel and $45 for an Ecoboost owner then that drops the savings down to $269.88 a year or $22.49 a month. Then you add in the DEF which is generally at a rate of 2% of 1 gallon of diesel consumed. An average fuel economy of 22.4 over 16,550 miles is 739 gallons which brings you to 14.78 gallons of DEF used. At Walmart's current price of $11.97 for a 2.5 gallon jug, that comes out to $70.77 cents for 14.78 gallons. This drops your savings down to $199.11 a year or just $16.59 a month. The $30 fuel filter will drop the savings to $169.11 a year($14.09 a month), but that is at a longer than 16.5k mile interval.

These calculations are based on the average person with the links provided for the data and not some small percentage of people like you and I who drive a lot more per year. I will bet you $1000 that if you go ask an Ecoboost owner or any other V8 truck owner that you can save them less than $17 a month if they switch to a truck engine with over 130 less horsepower, less capability, and less performance a vast majority will go tell you to pound sand and they will keep their truck.

* This post was last edited 01/14/18 10:03pm by ShinerBock *   View edit history

Groover

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Posted: 01/14/18 10:02pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ShinerBock, you pretty well summed it up but I don't see any mention of the diesel costing around $4,000 more to start with. It seems like that would work out to about $50/month on the pretty common 7 year loan. I just did rough calculations in my head, please forgive me for not being exact. Anyway, that means that I would have to pay an extra $35/month for all of the less capability that you mentioned plus dealing with DEF and smelling like diesel fuel most of the time that I fill up. I wonder if this engine uses a CP4 HPFP or something equivilant? Doesn't take me long to arrive at my conclusion. I like my 3.5.

I have heard that Ford claims the savings will be much better when trailer pulling. Since Ford does not publish economy numbers for trailer pulling I guess that we will have to wait several more months for some independent tests. Maybe then the numbers will work better for diesels.

Allamakee1

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Posted: 01/14/18 10:06pm Link  |  Quote  |  Print  |  Notify Moderator

ShinerBock wrote:

Allamakee1 wrote:


I didn’t cherry pick anything, I used the data you provided. You were the one who all the sudden argued with the data you provided. More people are putting pens to paper and making the efficient decisions, amazing that 4 individual auto makers are now making 1/2 ton diesels. I’m getting tired of arguing with you but I’ll respond if you continue to question my honesty and integrity. I explained my situation and my personal opinion, you are the one projecting your opinion on what the masses would prefer even though you don’t know their individual situation.



Yes, you did. You cherry picked the fuel prices with the diesel and gas being the same price in your calculations even though it is much higher in most places and then you cherry picked the percentages of engines sold leaving out the 5.0L to make it look like more people preferred the economy engine.

Yes, you explained your situation and personal opinion just as I have explained mine which is that most would probably not be willing to give up that much power and capability for such little monetary gain. If the gain was greater(ie increase in fuel prices) then I can see it, but not if it remains less than $50 a month in savings.

So essentially, if you drive the average 16,550 per year most American male drives a year(LINK) and the gasoline prices in your area is the $2.50(current US average) and diesel was $2.99(current US average)(LINK). Then you to the average fuel mileage of the current 3.5L Ecoboost on fuelly which is 16.2 mpg(LINK) and then took the average for the Ecodiesel which is 22.4 mpg(LINK). That would give the average person a savings of $344.88 a year or just $28.74 a month on fuel alone.

Then add in the maintenance costs for both with the oil being about $120 for the Ecodiesel and $45 for an Ecoboost owner then that drops the savings down to $269.88 a year or $22.49 a month. Then you add in the DEF which is generally at a rate of 2% of 1 gallon of diesel consumed. An average fuel economy of 22.4 over 15,000 miles is 670 gallons which brings you to 13.4 gallons of DEF used. At Walmart's current price of $11.97 for a 2.5 gallon jug, that comes out to $64.16 cents for 13.4 gallons. This drops your savings down to $205.72 a year or just $17.14 a month. The $30 fuel filter will drop the savings to $175.72 a year($14.64 a month), but that is at a longer than 16.5k mile interval.

These calculations are based on the average person with the links provided for the data and not some small percentage of people like you and I who drive a lot more per year. I can guarantee you that if you go ask an Ecoboost owner or any other V8 truck owner that you can save them less than $18 a month if they switch to a truck engine with over 130 less horsepower, less capability, and less performance. I will bet you $1000 that a vast majority will go tell you to pound sand and they will keep their truck.


Good thing your not giving your opinion on what someone might consider enough of a savings to value. It is well known by now with you figures, you don’t believe the average person cares about savings if they can do what? Squeal their tires from a stop sign..... good thing I’m not 16 anymore I guess. This isn’t even the right location to argue the ideology of the masses due to the majority of people on this forum that need specific things out of their vehicles ie. towing capabilities.

Funny how your cherry picking your data and how you represent it. According to the US Energy administration, April, when I went back to, through October shows diesel has been cheaper than midgrain gasoline. November through December has diesel higher. I was giving you the benefit of the doubt with comparing them the same price. You are fortunate that at the time of this discussion, diesel is more expensive.

I didn’t leave out the 5.0 either, I included it in the less powerful engine category when comparing it to the 3.5 EB, as it’s less powerful.

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