Inverter, Solar, and Other Power Recommendations

[andrewh]

Hello All,

This is my first post on this site, so I hope I'm in the right area.

Last February, I purchased my first camper/RV, a 2015 Thor Ace 29.2, and am now in love with boondocking and traveling the Southwest US. Since I'm quite new to this, any and all recommendations and suggestions are appreciated.

When I first purchased the RV, I swapped out the factory installed coach batteries for a set of 2 12V 100AH batteries running in parallel, since the old batteries didn't seem to be maintained by the previous owner. We do not have an inverter, but I'd be interested in installing one to use for charging laptops, cell phones, and occasionally watching TV. What size inverter would you recommend for the battery setup and for the use that I am looking for? I also wouldn't be opposed to swapping out the batteries for a set of 4 6V if that would seem to make more sense for our use/need. I'm not the most knowledgeable when it comes to electrical installations, but follow directions very well. Is an inverter installation pretty straight forward and can someone with little electrical experience do this on their own?

I'd also be interested in using solar power for charging the batteries. My main concern would be installing panels on the roof and causing potential leaks, wind resistance, etc. Since we tend to boondock in an area for about a week at time, as long as our water/tanks last, I wouldn't mind having portable solar panels that I attach directly to the battery to charge. Would you recommend this type of setup, or should I really look into a roof installation? Considering the mentioned uses and battery setup, how many panels and what wattage would be recommended?

Thanks for taking the time to read this and any replies will be greatly appreciated.

[Almot]

If dinette gets in the way - remove the dinette.
Sometimes I forget that many people (most) are younger than me, there are more than 2 people in trailer, different issues. So I won't be preaching much. Still...

When the only place for cat heater is in front of dinette near door: .
Red extinguisher is near the door. The heater is actually in front of (missing) dinette bench. Bold spot is where the front bench was. Removed the bench temporary to run the propane line, and was amazed how much space I gained, and how much more comfortable and versatile the chair was, compared to the bench. Easy to get in/out of the table, nothing to bump into when walking. The bench was already cracking where it was attached to the wall - after 2 years with just me in the trailer. Donated it to local villagers on seasonal camp. For travel the chair is wedged between the table and the other dinette, or stored under bed.

Resale value? Doesn't matter after 5-6 years. When looking for a trailer, I saw this in relatively new rigs - people removed one of the benches. Here in DIY forum there are photos of mods with both benches and table removed in trailers and motorhomes, IKEA or Lowes pieces installed. It all looked nicer, roomier, more comfortable than OEM dinette. There are probably very few rigs where dinette is designed and placed well.

Clear cover on a cat heater is not a nice touch but a necessity in windy and dusty places of SouthWest. Catalytic pad and dust don't go together well.

[krobbe]

Almot wrote:
Without furnace or 12V thermostat of the fridge your energy budget is manageable... IF there is any charging. Heavy clouds will reduce solar harvest by half or more. Rain is a real killer, zero charging.

Portable suitcases are expensive per watt and inconvenient, compared to permanent installs. BUT... Any solar is better than no solar. Even heavy energy user would benefit from a small solar. Battery likes getting to 100% once a day, and the last 10-15% are very slow, so with generator you either run it all day or bring battery to only 85-90%. Solar is good for those last 15%, run genny in the morning and leave the rest to solar.

Olympic cat heater is easier on propane than Buddy. Less fumes too.

Thanks Almot. Good info!
I'll install a larger permanent solar setup when I go snowbirdin' down to Arizona(in 10 years). But for 4 weeks a year with the family, a small system is better than running a genny every other day. I saw someone using a portable one in Jasper and was having carb issues with my Honda. Would've been nice to have it then.

I don't have a good place to mount a cat heater but will install one in my next retirement rig. My folks have one in theirs.
The only place for the Buddy is in front of the dinette or door. Have only used it twice and barely made a dent in the small propane bottle. Used it mainly to take the chill out of the air in the morning so the kids would come out of their beds.

[Almot]

Without furnace or 12V thermostat of the fridge your energy budget is manageable... IF there is any charging. Heavy clouds will reduce solar harvest by half or more. Rain is a real killer, zero charging.

Portable suitcases are expensive per watt and inconvenient, compared to permanent installs. BUT... Any solar is better than no solar. Even heavy energy user would benefit from a small solar. Battery likes getting to 100% once a day, and the last 10-15% are very slow, so with generator you either run it all day or bring battery to only 85-90%. Solar is good for those last 15%, run genny in the morning and leave the rest to solar.

Olympic cat heater is easier on propane than Buddy. Less fumes too.

[krobbe]

Almot wrote:

krobbe wrote:
Hope this 100Watt portable does the job for next years trip to the Pacific Northwest.

I live on Pacific Northwest (BC). Short of a 3,000W solar home with no shading, with a shed full of batteries - solar of any size is a gamble here.

Though 100W is so very little that even in the best of climates it would be sustainable only for a real minimalist. Pumps, lights, radio, fridge circuits, very-very occasional laptop. Preferably no furnace use. Ready to turn the lights off and hit the hay early (warm sleeping bag) if it rains all day and there is zero charging. Converting lights to LED is a must, when living on 30 AH a day (or trying to).

My family is pretty good on power usage. I converted all lights to LED, no need to run the furnace in July. I have a BigBuddy heater I've used a couple times up in the Canadian Rockies at the Columbia Icefields and Jasper. Only power usage is for pump, lights, charging iPads/phones and stereo. We'll watch a DVD movie occasionally using a little 100 watt inverter for the TV. But when we're camping out west, much of the day is spent hiking and day tripping. If 100 watts doesn't quite get it, I'll add another 100 watt panel to it. But I wanted to try it first. Even if I have to run the generator only occasionally, it should cut down on the number of times drastically.

[Almot]

krobbe wrote:
Hope this 100Watt portable does the job for next years trip to the Pacific Northwest.

I live on Pacific Northwest (BC). Short of a 3,000W solar home with no shading, with a shed full of batteries - solar of any size is a gamble here.

Though 100W is so very little that even in the best of climates it would be sustainable only for a real minimalist. Pumps, lights, radio, fridge circuits, very-very occasional laptop. Preferably no furnace use. Ready to turn the lights off and hit the hay early (warm sleeping bag) if it rains all day and there is zero charging. Converting lights to LED is a must, when living on 30 AH a day (or trying to).

[krobbe]

Zamp Solar has a totally portable 120 Watt kit that you can just clip on to the batteries. Not cheap at $663. And it only comes with a 10A charge controller.

I just installed a Renogy 100 Watt Portable RV Kit for $329 with 20ft of cable and a 30A charge controller. This kit involves mounting the charge controller inside the RV.(I mounted mine inside the forward passthru to be close to the batteries) I spent a good amount of time researching what to use for the plug to connect the panel cable into. I used these SB 50 Connectors and mounted one to the frame for easy plugging.

I spent 3 weeks last summer without campground hookups up in the Canadian Rockies. Could've really used some solar. Was running the Honda2000 every 2 days to charge the batts. Hope this 100Watt portable does the job for next years trip to the Pacific Northwest.

[Almot]

I think Grape 40A PWM is (one of) the best bang for the buck for arrays up to 500W.
Unless the preference is 24V panels and MPPT - often the case with arrays over 350-400W, even though 40A PWM could handle a bit more than that.

[westend]

Home Depot is another option when looking for solar systems. They sell the Grape Solar products and some deals are attractive.

[steveksfc]

Research, research and research again. There are many videos as well as postings on solar power and installation. They will show how they installed theirs whether a portable unit or fixed to the top of the camper. The big thing to remember is for boondocking you will need a big battery bank. Size depends on how much power you will need. I know many who have purchased their solar off of Amazon and are doing fine.

[Almot]

He's probably over his head already.

Getting a small inverter should be the first step and is a no-brainer.

Solar is a separate saga, more choices there.

I would not buy solar parts on Amazon unless I have already done my homework, know exactly what part I am looking for, and this part just happens to be cheaper on Amazon.

[CherokeeClimber]

Lots of good advice above:)
Your best bet is to do some of your own research and learn a little about your options - research costs, installation, and of course your needs. Plenty of DIY kits for sale from various manufacturers - check out amazon... Pretty easy install for the average diy person.

[Almot]

... in case if you are already lost and scared after looking at all the different installs on that list - many of this don't apply to you. Some are old, some are huge, some are tilted, some are made for specific roof material.

If you decide that you only need 200W or less, then it's simple. No beefy wires, no conduits, no roof junction boxes.

If you decide that you need 350W or more, then the easiest way would be to use 24V panels with MPPT controller - not 12V panels and PWM controller. Then you can still have it without beefy wires, conduits and junction boxes on the roof.

No MPPT-bashing here please, - this will be more than the OP can absorb 🙂

[Almot]

When I first purchased the RV, I swapped out the factory installed coach batteries for a set of 2 12V 100AH batteries running in parallel

Get those 4*6 if there is enough room, but this is not crucial if your energy needs are what you said. 2*100 AH will do.

I'd be interested in installing one to use for charging laptops, cell phones, and occasionally watching TV. What size inverter would you recommend for the battery setup and for the use that I am looking for?

200W inverter, and this doesn't change if you add more batteries. $25 modified sine like 175W GoPower will do for laptops and phones, it "might" work with TV or might not. Some TV prefer Pure Sine inverters, those cost more.

Is an inverter installation pretty straight forward and can someone with little electrical experience do this on their own?

For 200-300W inverter, - yes. Just run any wire that you have in your shed. A few old lamp cords spliced together to make 15-20ft run from battery to inverter. Place inverter near TV and tuck that lamp cord so that you won't trip over it. Without basic electricity knowledge I wouldn't do anything else like wiring inverter output into 120V receptacles of the trailer etc.

I'd also be interested in using solar power for charging the batteries. My main concern would be installing panels on the roof and causing potential leaks, wind resistance, etc.

Your worries are misplaced. There is no concern with wind resistance on flat panels (not tilted). There is no concern with leaks with #10 screws in 3/4" particle board of the roof. Just use stainless screws and plenty of Dicor sealant under the mounting brackets and on the screw heads.

Since we tend to boondock in an area for about a week at time, as long as our water/tanks last, I wouldn't mind having portable solar

With your minimalist use you need at least 180W solar if it's mostly sunny and 400W if it's not. (There is also a rule to oversize the solar by 30-50% from what you think you need, this has been proven by thousands users). You will run several other devices that you didn't mention - pumps, lights, 12V circuit of propane fridge, possibly furnace. Portable "suitcases" are 100-120W max, as I recall, and it will be more expensive per watt than roof-mounted. Portable could be beneficial in partially shaded areas though. When parked in dense leafy shade, solar power is reduced several times.

portable solar panels that I attach directly to the battery to charge

You don't attach any panel bigger than 15-20W "to the battery directly". Portable suitcases include solar controller that is wired between the panel and battery. If you buy panels for roof install, there are also kits that include the controller (check Solar Blvd), or you can buy controller separately (that would be my preference).

PS: there has been a tendency to post "solar" questions in Tech section, rather than DIY.

[rickhise]

A little off point, I must be reading from responders who Rv in mild climates.
In the south we would always look for shade.

But I learned a lot of helpful bits thanks guys